Ex Parte Order Defense Questions..?

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Re: Ex Parte Order Defense Questions..?

Unread postby PerniciousLord » Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:30 pm

grandet2 wrote:Write down all the times she threatened to harm herself, then write down how you handled it then and how will you handle it now?


I have screenshots of them, I handled them by trying to talk to her, by trying to be there for her. I don't have to handle it anymore, the only thing I have to worry about or care about is my children, NOT my STBX. If it comes to it, where she gets like that again, I'll try to get her to go get help, if she refuses, well then I'll ask the courts for full custody.
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Re: Ex Parte Order Defense Questions..?

Unread postby fisher_dad » Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:38 am

grandet2 wrote:Bite your tongue, shake your head, throw your hands up in the air and say "Your honor, it is obvious what she is saying that she is unable to support a healthy relationship between the father and the children".
So every time OC makes an accusation, don't defend it, accuse them of just trying to kick you in the nuts again when you are working so hard to be a good dad.

Bro, this is family court, the truth has not place it it, if you believe they will be fair if you tell the truth then you might was well believe that "Anna Nicole married for love".


There's a big difference between who you show the court you are and what your thoughts are when someone messes with your children. I would never endorse dropping the latter in the heat of the moment as I am human.

Some of my own experience:

I expected and received a scathing symphony of blame that was complete fiction. Police reports that I drove all night to get the night before actually saved me and were my truth for the day as she was caught in lies with more than hearsay. Saying 'no she didn't' would not have cut it.

As I walked up to the magistrate today the very judge that presided over my PFA case a year ago was having a chuckle about some outlandish divorce court antics. Judge: "I didn't believe the large male when he said small female broke his nose and jaw and thought it was surely a lie, then she admitted to it!" /laugh.
He was lucky she was honest.

Know what the court is looking for and be specific and provable is my point OP. The vets here are good and giving you high points. Bring substance to the table so you have a leg to stand on. They will not listen long to explanations so make it count.
You get what you put up with.

The List: http:http://forum.mensdivorce.com//viewtopic.php?t=13374
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Re: Ex Parte Order Defense Questions..?

Unread postby grandet2 » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:34 am

PerniciousLord wrote:
grandet2 wrote:Write down all the times she threatened to harm herself, then write down how you handled it then and how will you handle it now?


I have screenshots of them, I handled them by trying to talk to her, by trying to be there for her. I don't have to handle it anymore, the only thing I have to worry about or care about is my children, NOT my STBX. If it comes to it, where she gets like that again, I'll try to get her to go get help, if she refuses, well then I'll ask the courts for full custody.


1. There is no "then" brother. You need to seed those thoughts in the judges head now and slow work on them.
2. You need to show the court you care for your stbx as you need her to be best mother possible. This will show that you are responsible and not talking out of spite for her. Build credibility and court will discount her delusional rant.
3. Also in the guise of caring you can bring to light issues she needs to address, which will go a long way to question her credibility. Credibility in court is everything.

How you word shite is important, assume you hate cats as much as your stbx, which one below should you tell the court when asked if you like cats:

a. I like cats but I am deathly allergic to them. So even though I love them I have to avoid them.
b. Flip cats, flip em, they remind me of my vile stbx.
c. I love cats, they taste like chikin.
“A woman worries about the future until she gets a husband, while a man never worries about the future until he gets a wife.”
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Re: Ex Parte Order Defense Questions..?

Unread postby TJinCA » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:53 am

PerniciousLord wrote:
grandet2 wrote:Write down all the times she threatened to harm herself, then write down how you handled it then and how will you handle it now?


I have screenshots of them, I handled them by trying to talk to her, by trying to be there for her. I don't have to handle it anymore, the only thing I have to worry about or care about is my children, NOT my STBX. If it comes to it, where she gets like that again, I'll try to get her to go get help, if she refuses, well then I'll ask the courts for full custody.


Well, she has said and written some things, while you were sitting in the car with a loaded gun in your lap. I don't see you coming out ahead in the "who's more of a suicide risk" competition.

I think your focus on that topic needs to be that you own your prior actions (don't try to sugar coat it as a "gun safety" issue), you're getting help, the help seems to be working and you're committed to continue.

If you think your wife is an active danger to your kids that's an urgent matter that you should be addressing now. But under present circumstances you need to recognize that you may wind up proving that neither parent should have custody of your kids.
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Re: Ex Parte Order Defense Questions..?

Unread postby dad2grls » Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:14 am

PerniciousLord wrote:If it comes to it, where she gets like that again, I'll try to get her to go get help, if she refuses, well then I'll ask the courts for full custody.


If she gets like what? As the other poster said, YOU were the one with the gun in your lap while sitting alone in the car in the garage and you were driven a way in a squad car for a mental eval following the incident, during which time you admitted to anxiety and depression.

You need to be realistic. she's the mom, she's the primary caregiver, and you've got a restraining order against you that prohibits you from even speaking to your kids. If you ask for full custody based on nothing more than your wife having some sort of emotional upset, you're going to get laughed out of the courtroom.

I'm surprised your attorney hasn't discussed all of this with you- if he or she HAS, and indicated you might want to try for full custody I'm going to gently suggest your attorney is very "conflict driven" which in the end, only pads the attorney's pockets and wastes a lot of their clients time and money fighting useless battles they have no hope of winning.

Your posts sound like they're written by a person who has no legal representation whatsoever.

How'd the hearing go yesterday?
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Re: Ex Parte Order Defense Questions..?

Unread postby PerniciousLord » Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:53 pm

dad2grls wrote:Your posts sound like they're written by a person who has no legal representation whatsoever.

How'd the hearing go yesterday?


My attorney got the judge to postpone it again, until the 24th of January. In the meantime, they are trying to gather my medical records from where I admitted myself for treatment, a statement(or subpoena) of the officer that I left to go seek treatment with, and any other necessary or relevant documents before we discuss out strategy. I feel like the fact that I left voluntarily, that there was no report written, the officer had me sit in the front seat for the trip, and things of that nature should help to show the judge I wasn't a danger to anyone. I *hope* anyways. I'm also hoping that my psychiatrist wrote in his report/evaluation where he stated that he felt I was a "low risk" patient. He actually sought to release me early, but I asked to stay longer in treatment. I'm hoping that this, along with all their observations of me while I was in treatment, will go a long way to refute this. I do care about my STBX, that's why I'm filing for the divorce, because it is what SHE wants.
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Re: Ex Parte Order Defense Questions..?

Unread postby dad2grls » Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:04 pm

PerniciousLord wrote:My attorney got the judge to postpone it again, until the 24th of January. In the meantime, they are trying to gather my medical records from where I admitted myself for treatment, a statement(or subpoena) of the officer that I left to go seek treatment with, and any other necessary or relevant documents before we discuss out strategy.


Ok, this makes sense, thanks for the update, your attorney seems to be on the ball. Too bad it's another 2 weeks before you have a chance of seeing or at least speaking to your children but at least it's not months.

l I feel like the fact that I left voluntarily, that there was no report written, the officer had me sit in the front seat for the trip, and things of that nature should help to show the judge I wasn't a danger to anyone. I *hope* anyways. I'm also hoping that my psychiatrist wrote in his report/evaluation where he stated that he felt I was a "low risk" patient. He actually sought to release me early, but I asked to stay longer in treatment. I'm hoping that this, along with all their observations of me while I was in treatment, will go a long way to refute this. I do care about my STBX, that's why I'm filing for the divorce, because it is what SHE wants.


I know you need to vent and you do this in most of your posts, and if it makes you feel better than I guess that's something but it won't do any good and just adds a bunch of white noise for the helpful advice givers on this forum who really don't need to read about what you hope is going to happen.

Of course you hope for a positive outcome, we all do. But that won't get you better advice.
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Re: Ex Parte Order Defense Questions..?

Unread postby PerniciousLord » Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:08 pm

I'm just wondering if those things will help any. Especially if I go the route of saying that I made a mistake, it was the only time it has ever happened/will ever happen. I just need to know what will help the most.
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Re: Ex Parte Order Defense Questions..?

Unread postby afc » Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:11 pm

Should help, especially if you have professionals to corroborate it and have backed it up with work and making a plans for alternate activities when things get heated again.

What every judge fears is that they drop a restraining order and then a tragedy (usually murder/suicide) happens. The fall out from that is catastrophic.

You need to make sure you are not seen as a tragedy waiting to happen.
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Re: Ex Parte Order Defense Questions..?

Unread postby dad2grls » Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:14 pm

PerniciousLord wrote:I'm just wondering if those things will help any. Especially if I go the route of saying that I made a mistake, it was the only time it has ever happened/will ever happen. I just need to know what will help the most.


This sort of specific legal advice is best dispensed by a licensed competent attorney, one who is well versed in the case laws of your state, who has vast experience in these matters, and better yet knows how the judge tends to rule and what strategy will work best.

Take advice given by internet posters in this regard with a grain of salt, there's a LOT at stake here and saying you made a mistake and that you admitted yourself and stayed longer than you had to because you know you struggle with anxiety and depression may work for or against you.

From my own personal experience, which I said has some remarkable similarities to yours, my attorney advised me to acknowledge I had a problem (anger issues, depression, anxiety), and that I was in therapy to fix it (even though they were all caused by my imploding marriage and my exwife's actions that were related to it).

So you probably don't want to go in there and stubbornly insist there's nothing wrong with you given that you were in the garage with a loaded gun in your lap, but you don't want to make it sound like you were close to losing control but reigned it back in before any damage was done.
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