Want to divorce, but not sure it's the right play (MA)

Tips on divorce for men considering or starting the divorce process. Get marriage separation tips for men in this divorce forum and child custody forum.

Re: Want to divorce, but not sure it's the right play (MA)

Unread postby Trevor » Mon Apr 03, 2017 6:56 pm

1. Find a job with a short commute, even if you have to take a cut in pay. Now. Getting a divorce while you have to be out of the house twelve hours a day for your non-local job is a sure fire way to get less parenting time. Now is the time to make that move.

2. Cut her off financially. "You're < edited > other people. Let them pay for your salon bill and gym membership." You can't force her to get a job, but without money, her choices are limited. Keep the utilities paid, some food in the house, but she's on her own for her car/gas/insurance to go get boar-hogged by some schmuck. Step one (above) is the justification for a strong and immediate austerity plan.

3. Did you really fall for this < bovine scat >? "[S]he doesn't want to stop seeing other people because she 'knows' that she'll never physically be enough for me." Who is the one presently < edited > other people?

4. DO Not Move Out. Period.

5. You considering sucking it up for a decade will fail. Why? Her being an adult dependent will become inextricably entrenched in that time frame. Her exposure to STDs continues, putting you and the kids (indirectly) at risk. Your happiness and peace of mind will die (unless you are a remarkable human being in ability to compartmentalize). Think of the impact that living in a toxic and false household will have on your kids.

6. Think of your kids before you think of money. It's time to cut this leach off your flesh and let her suck on the men she's already sucking. Your kids deserve better.

7. May I remind you of that concept of human dignity? When the kids start coming home from school "Daddy is it true that mommy is a hoor? Everyone at school says she is dating the guy at the tennis club." How do you plan to handle that? [Rhet.]
"Personal density is directly proportional to temporal bandwidth."
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Re: Want to divorce, but not sure it's the right play (MA)

Unread postby massdad1234 » Mon Apr 03, 2017 8:26 pm

You're crossing over into that 10+ year territory. If you don't do it now, you are fuuked. You should start by carrying a digital voice recorder on your person at all times your soon to be ex is around.

Change jobs
cut her off $$$$
Get your balls back
journal/document all the time spent with children
spend time digging/looking for leverage/influence

Don't tip your hand, don't talk to anyone, start getting ready!
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Re: Want to divorce, but not sure it's the right play (MA)

Unread postby Chasbo » Tue Apr 04, 2017 8:28 am

Sounds like your wife is running a con game on you.

We all here realize what a man will put up for his kids. Personally I would divorce this leach but I would definitely make sure I was 200% prepared. Financially, emotionally, legally. She wouldn't know what hit her.
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Re: Want to divorce, but not sure it's the right play (MA)

Unread postby massdad1234 » Tue Apr 04, 2017 9:30 am

I have seen the real world divorce shared here and just wanted to post something for consideration. Don't let this rule your thoughts, you more than likely will settle and work out a plan between your soon to be ex and yourself. That is unless you start taking advice from your STBX and ignoring the advice here.

massdad1234 wrote:Also RE: Real world divorce, not that you shouldn't be cautions, but I also wanted to point out in the first paragraph the experience is drawn on:

Our questions regarding Massachusetts law and customs were answered by Gerald L. ("Jerry") Nissenbaum, a graduate of Boston University Law School (JD 1967, LLM Taxation 1985), who was admitted to the bar in 1967.  Some ninety-five percent of Nissenbaum's practice has been in high-value, highly contested, often-international divorce cases. Over more than 46 years, he’s had a 50/50 mixture of male and female clients. Nissenbaum believes that he has handled "well over 8,000 cases" and, in estimating the number that went to trial, gave us the following breakdown:
1-2 trial days (well over 200 cases)
2-5 trial days (about 40 cases)
5-10 trial days (about 20 cases)
10-25 trial days (about 10 cases).


300 of 8,000 is 3.75% of these high value cases going to trial, with 2.5% approximately lasting less than 2 days.

Lawyers told us that filing a restraining order was standard practice for a Massachusetts custody litigant, but our researcher could not confirm this based on the files available to her. Only 17 divorce lawsuits out of 144 cases with children included a restraining order that she could find in the same file as the divorce. (It is possible that restraining orders were requested and granted in other venues and/or in separate proceedings within the Probate court.)

More than likely you will settle on the courthouse steps or sooner. Which is why I am optimistic based on the strategy and tactics shared with group. Doesn't mean I won't be whipped soundly, but i'll take my chances of staying strong and outlasting the STBX, be prepared, have a list of my own, recording 24x7, documenting everything, freezing her out of money, reducing conflict, and not giving legal advice or strategy to the STBX.

I refuse to let defeat come from within.
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Re: Want to divorce, but not sure it's the right play (MA)

Unread postby dadforever » Tue Apr 04, 2017 11:33 am

Real world divorce is a great book, but that underlined part about the restraining orders is nonsense. Almost EVERY highly contested divorce has a restraining order.
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Re: Want to divorce, but not sure it's the right play (MA)

Unread postby massdad1234 » Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:11 pm

I would posit the numbers from the real world divorce don't back that up. The source for MA bears that out - Some ninety-five percent of Nissenbaum's practice has been in high-value, highly contested, often-international divorce cases. Of the 8,000+ cases, less than 2.5% that went to trial lasted more than 2 days. If the data aligns with as you believe, the research should have teased that out no?

How can the numbers tell the story one way, but not the other?

Again, OP you will more than likely settle, and if you follow the strategy to prevent you from being booted from the house (DVR 24/7), your chances increase significantly. I agree, being removed from the house isn't friendly to a dad's parenting goals, but there are also cases in this very forum from members who have battled back from that and achieved their outcomes.

The most important thing any dad can learn is never move out of the house, either voluntarily or involuntarily, otherwise your battle is significantly harder. I don't see anything in the real world divorce that counters that point. If you go to court and if you are high value and if you have a highly contested divorce and if and if and if....
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Re: Want to divorce, but not sure it's the right play (MA)

Unread postby Fatheroffour » Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:35 pm

My number one lesson would be to be involved in all aspects of child rearing so you have an established track record and are not playing catch up when she days she wants a divorce.

IOW, make the children a priority before divorce.
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Re: Want to divorce, but not sure it's the right play (MA)

Unread postby massdad1234 » Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:55 pm

can't argue with that FoF, as that truly does put you in the best position to maintain status quo. Can't be heavily involved if you don't live there.

For me that is the case - coached all their sports, get them all ready for breakfast/lunch/dinner/bedtime, do most of the pickups, review homework, discipline (and reward) them, doctors appointments, swaddle king, etc etc., now I just write it down to potentially be used as a single data point.

I'll let her explain to the judge how her plan is better than status quo.
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Re: Want to divorce, but not sure it's the right play (MA)

Unread postby dadforever » Sat Apr 08, 2017 11:35 am

massdad1234 wrote:I would posit the numbers from the real world divorce don't back that up. The source for MA bears that out - Some ninety-five percent of Nissenbaum's practice has been in high-value, highly contested, often-international divorce cases. Of the 8,000+ cases, less than 2.5% that went to trial lasted more than 2 days. If the data aligns with as you believe, the research should have teased that out no?

How can the numbers tell the story one way, but not the other?

Again, OP you will more than likely settle, and if you follow the strategy to prevent you from being booted from the house (DVR 24/7), your chances increase significantly. I agree, being removed from the house isn't friendly to a dad's parenting goals, but there are also cases in this very forum from members who have battled back from that and achieved their outcomes.

The most important thing any dad can learn is never move out of the house, either voluntarily or involuntarily, otherwise your battle is significantly harder. I don't see anything in the real world divorce that counters that point. If you go to court and if you are high value and if you have a highly contested divorce and if and if and if....


Often the restraining order comes out of the criminal court. Does that somehow negate the harmful effects of the RO on Dad?

I can tell you unequivocally, at least in Essex County, that just about every highly contested divorce has a restraining order. In fact the case that doesn't have one is a very rare exception.
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Re: Want to divorce, but not sure it's the right play (MA)

Unread postby whatever_works » Sat Apr 08, 2017 3:08 pm

Criminal court RO's are probably worse for dads. I've had a criminal court RO for 2 years and I can tell you that the confusion is worse than the actual order. The probate courts don't know how to handle it. My custody was in a sense settled by the criminal court. The judge doing temporary order hearing in probate court said he does not want to step on the toes of the criminal court judge. My wife's attorney used to relish the confusion and my first two attorneys were clueless.

From my understanding, probate court RO's are easier to handle for men's divorce attorneys.
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